Replay - Illegal touch

[Reverend30]

Disclaimer - I ask this question as someone with thorough knowledge of NCAA rules, but only a fan's (read: basically none) knowledge of the NFL rules, particularly as they pertain to replay.

Disclaimer 2 - I ask this question as a BLATANT New England homer.

In the third quarter of tonight's game, NE had a TD called off (under the new rule which causes all scoring plays to be reviewed) because the player stepped out of bounds and was the first to touch the ball (which I don't dispute).

However, I was always under the impression that a foul could not be called based on something seen in replay (such as an illegal touch).

I'm sure there is some exception I'm not aware of, just curious if anyone out there can cite chapter and verse on this situation.

[APG]

Rule 15, Section 9 Instant Replay

Reviewable Plays. The Replay System will cover the following play situations only:

(b) Passing plays:

2. Touching of a forward pass by an ineligible receiver.

And there are many fouls that are based on something seen in replay. For example an illegal forward pass from beyond the line of scrimmage or too many men on the field.

[Reverend30]

Rule 15, Section 9 Instant Replay

Reviewable Plays. The Replay System will cover the following play situations only:

(b) Passing plays:

2. Touching of a forward pass by an ineligible receiver.

And there are many fouls that are based on something seen in replay. For example an illegal forward pass from beyond the line of scrimmage or too many men on the field.

Thank you!

[chymechowder]

and is this a 5 yard penalty in the NFL?  they backed NE up 5 and replayed the down, which seemed odd.  (at least it's odd given my NCAA rules background).

the whole play was strange, in fact.  from the box score:

3rd and 11 at NYJ 14:

(Shotgun) T.Brady pass short left to R.Gronkowski for 14 yards, TOUCHDOWN. Penalty on NYJ-J.Leonhard, Illegal Contact, declined. The Replay Assistant challenged the pass completion ruling, and the play was REVERSED. (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short left to R.Gronkowski for 14 yards, TOUCHDOWN NULLIFIED by Penalty. PENALTY on NE-R.Gronkowski, Illegal Touch Pass, 5 yards, enforced at NYJ 14 - No Play.

so it went from Pats TD with a declined Jets penalty >> to no jets penalty for illegal contact since brady was outside the tackle box PLUS no td because gronkowski had stepped out. he had definitely been contacted by another defender (not the one who got the flag) just before stepping out, too.  no idea if after replay the officials deemed that gronkowski going out had nothing to do with the defender's contact, or if they're not allowed to look at THAT part of the play. 

mildly vexing to us pats fans, haha.  (it's fine, though, since they stomped NY.  )

but the 5 yards and replay the down, if that's the NFL rule, seems really weird. does anyone know if that''s the case?

[APG]

Yes, illegal touching of a forward pass is only a 5 yard penalty under NFL rules.

My guess on the replay is that the RO can't judge on his own why the player went out of bounds. If he was forced out illegally, there would have been a flag on the play, and the player would not be an ineligible receiver. If there's no flag, then the RO assumes the player was legally forced out or stepped OOB on his own.

Also when the QB leaves the pocket, illegal contact provisions do not apply anymore.

[chymechowder]

thanks but there's two kinds of illegal touching. there's an ineligible lineman intentionally touching a forward pass. (not sure if the NFL has the intentional part.).....and there's an eligible receiver going OOB and first touching.

in ncaa the former is 5 yards and replay the down. the latter is simply treated as an incomplete pass. LOD at previous spot

the pats TE stepped out.  but the officials did 5 yards and replay down. what i'm wondering is: does the NFL not have different enforcements for the 2 kinds of touching? if that's the case, it just seems like a weird point of difference between the 2 rulesets.

[APG]

Illegal touching is a five yard penalty period under NFL rules.

And yes, for there to be a penalty, an ineligible receiver must intentionally touch the ball.

[agegbg]

i had a question regarding this

last play between Buccaneers and Saints

it was 4th and 15 and freeman pass the ball to WR who catch the ball in end zone

Before he catch the ball  a defense player pushed him out of bounce and he get back inbonce directly

they got 5 yards and loss of down
game over..

can someone explain that for me?

thanks in advanced
Markus

[mishatx]

In the NFL rules, a player that goes out of bounds is not eligible to first touch the pass, no matter if we went out of his own accord or not.

In the NFL rules, if time expires on a play where offense commits a penalty, the game ends. If the offense scored on said play, the score is nullified, and the game ends.

[APG]

i had a question regarding this

last play between Buccaneers and Saints

it was 4th and 15 and freeman pass the ball to WR who catch the ball in end zone

Before he catch the ball  a defense player pushed him out of bounce and he get back inbonce directly

they got 5 yards and loss of down
game over..

can someone explain that for me?

thanks in advanced
Markus

Should point out that illegal touching is a 5 yard only penalty and not a loss of down.

[agegbg]

Thank you both for the explanation

Still bad for that call and a good cornerback can just give a little hit so a WR step on the line and can't receive a pass.