Author Topic: Receiver of the snap (re: Intentional Grounding)  (Read 6739 times)

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El Macman

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Receiver of the snap (re: Intentional Grounding)
« on: August 27, 2012, 01:31:36 PM »
So,  what was the 'correct' answer to NCAA exam question 43?

43. A, 3/5 @ A-20... The QB muffs the snap and the ball rolls back to the A-10. The Left Guard picks up the ball and from the A-10 throws a pass beyond the line of scrimmage into an area unoccupied by an eligible Team A player. The “Passer” was outside the tackle box when the pass was thrown.
A. A, 3/5 @ A-20; legal play.
B. A, 4/15 @ A-10; intentional grounding.
C. A, 4/10 @ A-15; previous spot foul.

Unless I am mistaken, I believe B was the 'correct' answer, under the unpublished interpretation that only the person for whom the snap was 'intended' had the privilege to legally ground a forward pass. Either that was untrue, or someone had a change of heart.

Check AR 7-3-2-X in the 2012-2013 book.

Offline Hawkeye

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Re: Receiver of the snap (re: Intentional Grounding)
« Reply #1 on: August 27, 2012, 01:48:07 PM »
Looks like a change of heart! Along with an editorial change  >:D

AR 7-3-2-X is consistent with an editorial change to 7-3-2-h-Exc

He changed:
"This applies only to the player who receives the snap."
to
"This applies only to the player who controls the snap or the resulting backward pass."


El Macman

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Re: Receiver of the snap (re: Intentional Grounding)
« Reply #2 on: August 27, 2012, 02:53:46 PM »
And a good and proper change of heart. :thumbup

Offline bossman72

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Re: Receiver of the snap (re: Intentional Grounding)
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2012, 02:23:34 PM »
Looks like a change of heart! Along with an editorial change  >:D

AR 7-3-2-X is consistent with an editorial change to 7-3-2-h-Exc

He changed:
"This applies only to the player who receives the snap."
to
"This applies only to the player who controls the snap or the resulting backward pass."

So what exactly is the difference between receiving and controlling the snap?

Offline TXMike

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Re: Receiver of the snap (re: Intentional Grounding)
« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2012, 03:17:10 PM »
In the context of this change it seems to be that the person who the ball first goes to may be the person who receives the snap but if he fails to control it then someone else might be the person who controls it, i.e. picks it up.

Offline ajv

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Re: Receiver of the snap (re: Intentional Grounding)
« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2012, 03:21:12 PM »
This doesn't answer your question, but to take it off at a tangent I was wondering what the difference would have been if the editor had used gains possession of rather than controls in this change of wording.

Quarterback A12 is in a shotgun formation. He muffs the backward pass awkwardly from the snapper. The ball bounces very high into the air to the left of the tackle box. Slot receiver A88 jumps and controls the ball but before he lands and being under immediate pressure he throws the ball forward and incomplete beyond the neutral zone where there is no eligible receiver.

Under previous interpretations, this would actually be regarded as batting the backward pass from the snap, right? So we would have illegal batting of the backward pass rather than a question of not being intentional grounding due to A88 being the first player to control the ball.

So could the wording in this change have been gains possession of because controls without possession would be some kind of batting?

Offline ajv

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Re: Receiver of the snap (re: Intentional Grounding)
« Reply #6 on: August 28, 2012, 05:44:45 PM »
Here's a counter example to my possession vs control thought:

Quarterback A12 is in a shotgun formation. He muffs the backward pass awkwardly from the snapper. The ball bounces very high into the air to the left of the tackle box. Slot receiver A88 jumps and controls the ball but before he lands he is hit by B55 and the ball pops out. The original QB A12 picks up the loose ball outside the tackle box and being under immediate pressure he throws the ball forward and incomplete beyond the neutral zone where there is no eligible receiver.

Additional thought: if B55's block is below the waist has he committed a foul?

Offline NVFOA_Ump

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Re: Receiver of the snap (re: Intentional Grounding)
« Reply #7 on: August 28, 2012, 07:09:18 PM »
And a good and proper change of heart. :thumbup

Conceptually a good and fair improvement, but as noted what does "controls" mean?  Should it actually be read to mean the 1st Team A player who actually secures possession and control of the ball after the snap or backward pass from the snapper so that he could then intentionally make a forward pass?
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