Loose Ball

[dch]

3rd & 5 at the A40.  After a short gain A1 fumbles the ball when he is hit at the A44.  The ball is grounded and several players are moving towards it.  A6 doesn't know where the ball is and is just standing around taking up space.  In an attempt to get to the ball B3 dives into and thru A6 - below the waist and from the back.  A pile-up ensues and when the officials dig to the bottom they find A4 has the ball at the A43 yd-line. 

Is it a clipping foul on B3 or does he get a free pass because the ball was loose?

[mbyron]

Well, first things first: you don't get a "pass" on a clip because the ball is loose. So that's not it.

The covering official will have to judge whether it was a block or incidental contact. If it's a block (2-3-1: "Blocking is obstructing an opponent..."), then flag it. But as you're describing it, it's incidental. Pass.

Not all contact below the waist is a foul: some is accidental, incidental, or even coincidental.

[dch]

My intent was that the action by B was a clip.  He dove thru the back of the legs of an opponent.
The question that has come up in the local unit is regarding the legality of clips in the loose ball situation.  People are having trouble reading the wording of the rule book and differentiating between a push in the back above the waist and a clip when going for a loose ball.  The case book addresses the above the waist push but not the clip.

[mbyron]

Players are permitted to block each other off the ball, and some otherwise illegal techniques are legal when the ball is loose. As you point out, holding is one, block in the back is another (9.3.5A), provided these are done to separate an opponent from the ball.

Not everything goes, however. You can't spear an opponent off the ball, for example, and I would put clipping in this category. A good rule of thumb would be: if the penalty is 15 yards (PF, IBB, IHC, etc.), going for a loose ball does not excuse the foul.

I know of nothing written to support this interpretation.

[FBUmp]

Don't be a plumber.

[bbeagle]

Not everything goes, however. You can't spear an opponent off the ball, for example, and I would put clipping in this category. A good rule of thumb would be: if the penalty is 15 yards (PF, IBB, IHC, etc.), going for a loose ball does not excuse the foul.

I know of nothing written to support this interpretation.

The rule book states that you can commit holding in an attempt to get to a loose ball. However, if you are HOLDING during a loose ball just to hold, so your teammate can recover a loose ball, this is still holding.

For example, Player A1 is sacked by B1 and loses the ball. Player A1 is on the ground crawling trying to get the loose ball. Player B1 grabs Player A1 and holds him back from recovering the loose ball for a whole second. Imagine the player A1's arm reaching out and reaching out just inches from the loose ball on the ground. Player B2 then comes into the area and jumps on the loose ball.

I would call holding on B1 as he was not attempting to recover a loose ball.

[cducote]

Beagle please reference the rule about holding during a loose ball. I could only find 9-3-5b.

[ThomasG]

This is where your judgement comes in.  If A6, as in the OP, is just taking up space and B3, as in the OP, is going for the loose ball, I've got nothing - especially if the loose ball is grounded.  I would expect B3 to go low because that's where the ball is.  Proximity to the loose ball is also a factor.  If a dive would get B3 from where he was to where the ball is (or close), OK.  If he's diving for a ball ten yards away, maybe not OK. 
But for A6 to be so close to a loose ball and just be standing there taking up space is a dangerous bit, man.  In my mind, I just can't see A6 seeing everyone going for the ball without him turning around (even just a little) to see what all the commotion is about.  If A6 is turning at all, the hit by B3 from behind may not be his fault at all.  You just have to be there and see the whole play.