Horsecollar and Poss Illegal Block in the Back

[TXMike]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2DE6tW5GVI

Horsecollar was called.  What about the block by Red #4?

(As usual, the commontatertots don't have a clue)

[TxSkyBolt]

Mike, where is Red #4?  Do you mean #64? 

[TXMike]

Red # 4 starts at the bottom of screen and ends up back in the inside and puts one on White 23

[El Macman]

When I first saw the block by #4 at full speed, my initial reaction was side block. When I look at it in step action - clearly a side block.

Not even close to a horse collar. I don't understand why so many of these are missed.

[maven]

Not even close to a horse collar. I don't understand why so many of these are missed.

Agree. Might be hard to see with the tackler's glove, but the S could have come in to help him off that.

[NVFOA_Ump]

When I first saw the block by #4 at full speed, my initial reaction was side block. When I look at it in step action - clearly a side block.

Agree with El Macman - at full speed with the defender coming in from off camera looks like a potential IBB.  In stop action, first contact is very clearly from the side.



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[El Macman]

Agree with El Macman - at full speed with the defender coming in from off camera looks like a potential IBB.  In stop action, first contact is very clearly from the side.

We agree it is a side block, but I thought it was a side block even in first look at full speed. The stop action helped confirm it for me.

[bama_stripes]

From a philosophy standpoint:

The tackle was around the head and the runner's legs buckled backward.  Isn't that the type of play the HC rule is meant to prevent?

[Razor]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2DE6tW5GVI

Horsecollar was called.  What about the block by Red #4?

(As usual, the commontatertots don't have a clue)

#4 looks more like a hit from the side.  The commentators are funny.  The R gives them the call and they continue to call it a FM. 

[Fatman325]

I am with Bama. This is a HC regardless of where the grab was. The knees buckled and the weight of the defender was on runner as he was pulled down.

EL Why not a HC? Is your reason about where the defender grabs the runner?

[fencewire]

well, it isn't a "knees buckling tackle" foul, it is a horsecollar, defined by grabbing inside the back or side collar of the jersey or shoulder pads.  Tackler clearly had his hand on the top of the shoulder pad of the runner, no hands inside anything.

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[maven]

This is a HC regardless of where the grab was.

What's the definition of a horsecollar tackle?

[TXMike]

9-1-15

Horse Collar Tackle
ARTICLE 15. All players are prohibited from grabbing the inside back collar of
the shoulder pads or jersey, or the inside collar of the side of the shoulder pads
RULE 9 / CONDUCT OF PLAYE RS AND OTHERS SUBJECT TO THE RULES FR-89
or jersey, and immediately pulling the ball carrier down. This does not apply
to a ball carrier, including a potential passer, who is inside the tackle box (Rule
2-34). Note that the tackle box disintegrates when the ball leaves it.
Roughing or

[bossman72]

What does everyone think of the block by LT #65?  I know he has good body position but he's practically pulling his shirt off.  Would we want that called?

[James]

Well you can see the U is in there talking to him really quickly. Probably a one time warning, then flag it.

[Magician]

Not even close to a horse collar and the side block wouldn't be a foul even if it was in the back because it it is so far from the POA. I would consider a PF because he was picking off a guy possibly out of the play.

[Wont_Do_To_Tell]

bossman72

I agree, i'd like to hear opins on the hold.  Appears to me, the defender is clearly trying to get away and the hold is preventing him from it.  Its also at the "point of attack".  Be hard not to throw on that.

What do others think?

[Birddog]

What does everyone think of the block by LT #65?  I know he has good body position but he's practically pulling his shirt off.  Would we want that called?

If I passed on that block in a HS (TX) game, I think the coach would have a coronary on the spot. DI I see that sort of block let go quite often. 

[110]

Hold, 65. Right at point of attack. Give the U a cuppa coffee, that's his call.

[El Macman]

Hold, 65. Right at point of attack. Give the U a cuppa coffee, that's his call.

Don't think so. Sure, he's got two hands full of jersey, but he keeps his feet moving, stays in front of the defender all the way, and doesn't twist, turn, or pull him down. I think they'd want a no-call on that.

The block by the WR is more suspect. He doesn't stay in front, and he ends up twisting the corner, and takes his feet away.

[110]

Don't think so. Sure, he's got two hands full of jersey, but he keeps his feet moving, stays in front of the defender all the way, and doesn't twist, turn, or pull him down. I think they'd want a no-call on that

My view: I see the defender's right arm restricting the attempt by the defender to penetrate the back field.  Watch the defender's torso: his upper body is leaning right, his feet are trying to go left. The feet tell a lot, here.

[Diablo]

Don't think so. Sure, he's got two hands full of jersey, but he keeps his feet moving, stays in front of the defender all the way, and doesn't twist, turn, or pull him down. I think they'd want a no-call on that.

Yeah, he stays in front of the defender by grabbing the defender's jersey, thus preventing the defender from moving to the outside.  Isn't that restricting the defender's movement?