Penalty Enforcement

[WestGeorgiaStripes]

Team A rushes for a first down.  There is a dead-ball unsportsmanlike on A prior to the ready for play.  Do you back it up 15 yards from the end of the run....A 1/10?  On the flip, if the unsportsmanlike comes after the ready for play (not likely) but prior to the snap....would it be A 1/25?  Thanks.

[maven]

1. Yes.

2. Yes.

[WestGeorgiaStripes]

Thank you.  I have one more scenario....
A 4/10 @ B20....A lines up to go for it....then, they run the field goal unit onto the field (10 players), 1 player from the offense doesn't quite leave the field (stays on the field-next to the sideline).  A is charged with a delay of game penalty.  After backing A up 5 yards, they stay in field goal formation.  The sneaky 11th player just backs up 5 yards.  He is still unnoticed and on the LOS.  The holder takes the snap and throws a pass to the wide open 11th player for a TD.  I flagged the play for illegal participation because he never re-established himself by going inside the #'s.  In my opinion this was a new play and he had to re-establish eligibility.  Correct call?

Has anyone else seen plays similar to this?  Please share so that we can all be on the lookout and make the proper calls.

[TampaSteve]

A fundamantal: can never have anything BUT 1/10.
So if USC is before the ready, back up 15yds & still 1/10
If after the ready, now you got 1/25.

Ques2:
players have to be inside the numbers at the ready.  so the lurking as you described is flagged.
REMEMBER, if the holder takes the snap & throws, he must rise to his feet. (sometimes you can see the kneeling holder flip it to a RB)
Seems you shoulda had illegal sub & shut it down before you got to IP.

[HLinNC]

Acutally on the 7-2-1 violation, all A players must between the nine yard marks at some point from the RFP to the snap, not AT the RFP.   This is an illegal formation foul as A can correct at any time prior to the snap.  Assess as live ball foul at the snap.


I am assuming that your DOG foul is unrelated to the A player lingering near the sideline.  It would seem that you had a potential pretended substitution when the  A player "doesn't quite leave the field",  thus Illegal participation if the DOG doesn't get blown.

[maven]

Thank you.  I have one more scenario....
A 4/10 @ B20....A lines up to go for it....then, they run the field goal unit onto the field (10 players), 1 player from the offense doesn't quite leave the field (stays on the field-next to the sideline).  A is charged with a delay of game penalty.  After backing A up 5 yards, they stay in field goal formation.  The sneaky 11th player just backs up 5 yards.  He is still unnoticed and on the LOS.  The holder takes the snap and throws a pass to the wide open 11th player for a TD.  I flagged the play for illegal participation because he never re-established himself by going inside the #'s.  In my opinion this was a new play and he had to re-establish eligibility.  Correct call?

Eligibility is not the issue, and the penalty for failing to be inside the numbers is IF, not IP.

Without the DOG, it's pretty clear you've got IP (compare 9.6.4B). (You can't get both: DOG is a DB foul, and it wouldn't be IP until the snap.)

After enforcing the DOG, the pretended substitution is over, and you cannot flag IP. But it's still IF when he fails to come inside the numbers.

March them back enough, and the coach might re-think his little trick play.

[Tom.OH]

March them back enough, and the coach might re-think his little trick play.

And in the pregame meeting with the coach he said no they did not run any trick plays...

[WestGeorgiaStripes]

Thanks fellas.

[bossman72]

I like the IP call here - using the substitution process to deceive