Missed Targeting at Scrimmage

[Bulldog75]

At our scrimmage last week I'm pretty sure we missed a targeting call.  Would like some input on how to avoid repeating this.

Scenario: Deep pass towards my (S) side, ball bounces up off receiver (slot, B's assignment), CB is making a play on the ball in the air but fails to catch it.  I look back to the receiver and he and the S are both laid out and slow to get up.  Coaches and trainers come out and help them up and off.  I'm assuming the safety drilled the receiver in the head once the ball was up in the air, but neither the B or I saw it as we were both tracking the live ball.  The H didn't see it because he was watching the QB who had booted out his way to make sure he was behind the LOS.  The U didn't get turned around quickly enough to see it.

I'm guessing in a scenario like that, the B or S should follow the ball and the other guy should stick with the receiver?  I can see a similar scenario happening on a punt.  I believe the mechanics on that say for the B to stick with the receiver and the F or S to track the ball.

[ElvisLives]

No easy or great answer here. We need to know where the ball is, to rule on touching, for eligibility purposes. But, if we don't really have a threat of an ineligible player touching the ball, then we should come off of that action and look for the guy with a "brick in his hand." That is usually best done by an off-side official (F), or an official who does not his 'key' in the immediate action. Don't watch the ball - check the players, and see if one of them has drawn a bead on the defenseless player. Then keep your attention on that guy, and see what he does. As humans, that's the best we can do.

[Snapper]

The H and F should both have looks at this.  Maybe not great looks, but it seems to me that they gotta have opinions.

The F doesn't have anything else to look at.

And unless someone is committing a personal foul in front of the H, he should be able to get a look at that pass as well.  I don't buy that he was still looking to see if the QB was behind the line.  Not on a deep pass.  He needs to make a decision and then move onto the next threat, which was that deep pass.

[Clear Lake ref]

Total speculation but if the S is also laid out perhaps it was an unintentional collision where both were focused on that ball.

[Bulldog75]

That could definitely be the case.  None of the officials saw the action, so nobody knows if there was or was not targeting.  BUT it seems to me that one of us should have kept an eye on the defenseless receiver and seen what happened. 

If there's not an existing mechanic that I'm missing, I think I will propose to our B that he keeps the player in a scenario like this, and the deep wings will track the ball.

[TxSkyBolt]

See Elvis response. Don?t follow the ball when there?s a threat to a receiver.

[Bulldog75]

If we had both stayed on the receiver and left the ball, then how could we know the outcome of the pass?  Did the corner complete an interception, or did it fall to the ground incomplete?  Isn't the outcome of the play as important as protecting the receiver?

[JasonTX]

As others have said too many eyes on the ball.  It happens far too often.   I see it a lot on fumbles.  When 3 bean bags are tossed, we got problems.   3 people watching one player.

[HOULJ]

I would just add not to follow the ball once it is in the air. Nothing is happening to the ball in the air. Stay with your keys and watch the action.

[dammitbobby]

The H and F should both have looks at this.  Maybe not great looks, but it seems to me that they gotta have opinions.

The F doesn't have anything else to look at.

And unless someone is committing a personal foul in front of the H, he should be able to get a look at that pass as well.  I don't buy that he was still looking to see if the QB was behind the line.  Not on a deep pass.  He needs to make a decision and then move onto the next threat, which was that deep pass.

I agree with this - H should have had eyes on this.  Yes, he has the responsibility to determine if he was behind the line, but how long does it take to decide that, and shift focus downrange, while a deep ball is in the air?  And he would have been far enough away to not be focused on the ball, but on the action on the receiver, even if the ball bounced up and away, he still should still have his antenna up if the S was still coming in hot and really did launch and make contact.

[AlUpstateNY]

The H and F should both have looks at this.  Maybe not great looks, but it seems to me that they gotta have opinions.

"Opinions" are included in Game Ticket prices and most, if not all Sideline passes and press observations, bur do not extend to Game Officials.  Officials are required to personally observe any/every action they are going to rule on.  Established "Mechanics" are designed to provide valuable assistance to help the observation of critical situations in a fast moving, multi faceted, instantly changing sequence of simultaneous actions, but NEVER produce absolute/total perfection.

Officials are NOT permitted to presume, assume, deduce, guess.  If we don't actually SEE "it", we simply CANNOT (should not) call "it". The ONLY potential remedy is to reflect/review existing mechanics (after the fact) to ensure possible future (better) compliance in hopes to avoid repetition.

[dammitbobby]

You're conflating throwing a flag for a foul, and seeing something likely across the field, in your vision/zone (that isn't technically your direct responsibility).  In this specific scenario, multiple officials had the opportunity to see the action around the completed/incomplete catch, and then if the safety had a brick in his hand, coming in hot.  H, S, and B should all have had this in their direct view, and F definitely should be aware of what is happening on the other side of the field, and if he's paying attention, most likely would be able to see the safety screaming in for a big hit, which should hold his attention. Taking information - and opinions on what transpired - from all the officials who might have a relevant piece of information, is how we get the hard/complex calls right. 

[Etref]

Always told “ fish in your own pond, unless you can catch a BIG ONE “

[ElvisLives]

Always told “ fish in your own pond, unless you can catch a BIG ONE “

Absolutely, and Targeting would be a “big one.”