Author Topic: Multiple live ball fouls  (Read 11777 times)

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Offline TXMike

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Multiple live ball fouls
« on: June 01, 2011, 07:27:59 PM »
3d and 10 at the 50.  QB A12 runs the ball to the B-35. During the run, A80 is flagged for a hold at the line of scrimmage.  He is also flagged for taunting the defender he had just tackled to the ground while the runner was advancing to the B-35.  RULING?

Offline Etref

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Re: Multiple live ball fouls
« Reply #1 on: June 01, 2011, 07:56:13 PM »
3rd and a ton at the A25

10 yard hold from the 50 then the LB enforced as a DB 15 from the 40
" I don't make the rules coach!"

Offline TXMike

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Re: Multiple live ball fouls
« Reply #2 on: June 01, 2011, 07:59:41 PM »
2011 rules?

Offline Andrew McCarthy

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Re: Multiple live ball fouls
« Reply #3 on: June 01, 2011, 08:00:10 PM »
I would assume with the rule change they'd have to decline the hold in order for the UNC to be enforced.

Offline BC70

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Re: Multiple live ball fouls
« Reply #4 on: June 01, 2011, 08:31:27 PM »
Wouldn't the hold be more advantageous.  3/20 @ A40

Offline TXMike

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Re: Multiple live ball fouls
« Reply #5 on: June 01, 2011, 08:33:03 PM »
Taunt was at same spot as the hold (50)

Offline JasonTX

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Re: Multiple live ball fouls
« Reply #6 on: June 01, 2011, 10:00:29 PM »
Decline the hold and accept the 15 yards for taunting from the 50.  It will be 3rd and 25 from A-35.

Firetackle

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Re: Multiple live ball fouls
« Reply #7 on: June 02, 2011, 03:17:59 AM »
Let's tweak it a little bit:

3/10 at the 50.  QB A12 runs the ball to the B-35. During the run A80 is flagged for a hold at the A-45.  He is also flagged for taunting the defender he had just tackled to the ground at A-45. A12 was tackled at the B-35.  RULING?


Offline Kalle

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Re: Multiple live ball fouls
« Reply #8 on: June 02, 2011, 03:49:38 AM »
Original play, fully agree with JasonTX.

Tweaked play: decline the hold, enforce the taunting from the basic spot, which is the spot of the foul, as taunting is not a personal foul. 3/30 from A-30.

Offline Getting Fat

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Re: Multiple live ball fouls
« Reply #9 on: June 02, 2011, 08:12:15 AM »
Tweaked play - wouldn't the basic spot be the original LOS?  Enforce the UNS conduct from the 50

DD

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Re: Multiple live ball fouls
« Reply #10 on: June 02, 2011, 08:18:39 AM »
From all the information I have seen this would be enforced just like a holding foul or any foul against a player. The following is taken from one of the bulletins sent out by RR.

"In trying to have a strong impact on such player behavior the committee in 2010 made an important change that will take effect in 2011. Beginning this season, unsportsmanlike conduct fouls by players will be treated as common fouls, in the sense that the penalty will be enforced the same as if the foul were holding or a block in the back or any other common foul. If the ball is alive when the player makes the taunting gesture, then the penalty is enforced at the spot of the foul—and the key outcome: no touchdown. One way to think about this is that starting in 2011 such a player will have a choice: he can score the touchdown, or he can taunt the opponent—but no longer can he have it both ways."

Offline TXMike

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Re: Multiple live ball fouls
« Reply #11 on: June 02, 2011, 08:19:20 AM »
Under 3 and 1, run ended beyond NZ so enfroce from spot of foul.  There are 4 specific exceptions to this, illegal use of hands, illegal block, holding, and personal fouls.  UC is not listed.

DD

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Re: Multiple live ball fouls
« Reply #12 on: June 02, 2011, 08:34:22 AM »
TxMike as RR stated in his bulletin "UNR will be treated as a common foul as if it were holding or block in the back".

Offline TXMike

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Re: Multiple live ball fouls
« Reply #13 on: June 02, 2011, 08:38:11 AM »
But he was not referring to this specific type of situation. That comment was made to make it clear it would be a LIVE BALL PENALIZED AS A LIVE BALL foul.

Offline Kalle

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Re: Multiple live ball fouls
« Reply #14 on: June 02, 2011, 11:22:28 AM »
TxMike as RR stated in his bulletin "UNR will be treated as a common foul as if it were holding or block in the back".

UNS can be thought to be like illegally batting/kicking the ball, enforcementwise. These are common (live-ball) fouls, but are enforced from the spot of the foul when the related run ends beyond the spot of the foul, no exception for the foul being behind the LOS.

Offline TXMike

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Re: Multiple live ball fouls
« Reply #15 on: June 02, 2011, 12:18:29 PM »
TxMike as RR stated in his bulletin "UNR will be treated as a common foul as if it were holding or block in the back".

He actually said UNSPORTSMANLIKE CONDUCT, not UNR.  But if it was flagged as unneccesary roughness (live ball), then it WOULD be a PF and WOULD qualify for previous spot enforcement.